Cushing's Disease/Syndrome | Electronic Forum Digest 42

CUSHINGS-PETS Digest 42

Topics covered in this issue include:

1) Re: runny eyes
by Linda Wroth <lwroth@ix.netcom.com>
2) Re: runny eyes
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
3) Re:runny eyes
by Jackie Siniard <siniardj@email.uah.edu>
4) RE: Urine tests
by "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
5) new list member
by Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
6) Anipryl
by sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
7) Re: new list member
by Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
8) Re: Anipryl
by JCirino@aol.com
9) Re: new list member
by JCirino@aol.com
10) Re: new list member
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
11) Re: Anipryl
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
12) Re: Anipryl
by sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
13) Re: Anipryl
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
14) Re: Anipryl
by sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
15) RE: new list member
by Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
16) Re: Anipryl
by Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
17) RE: new list member
by Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
18) RE: new list member
by Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
19) Re: new list member
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
20) Schonus Update
by L Boyce <lboyce@warwick.net>
21) just a quickie
by Susan Kuchinskas <hautlynx@sirius.com>
22) Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by <loiskos@ix.netcom.com>
23) Re: new list members
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
24) Re: new list member
by DLowder25@aol.com
25) Re: Anipryl
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
26) Re: new list member
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
27) Diabetic cushbabies
by DLowder25@aol.com
28) Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by <loiskos@ix.netcom.com>
29) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by Cindy Venable <cindyv@ntr.net>
30) Re: new list member
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
31) Re: Schonus Update
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
32) Re: new list member
by Jenny Kellstedt <jk@bradley.bradley.edu>
33) Re: new list member
by "Capa97" <Capa97@ix.netcom.com>
34) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by hilbro@juno.com (h hilbro)
35) Re: new list member
by "Scottee Meade" <scottee@huskynet.com>
36) Re: several topics covered
by write2tom@juno.com (Thomas D Johnston)
37) Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by CBABTPC@aol.com
38) Re: new list member
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
39) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by CBABTPC@aol.com
40) new lister with questions!
by Paula Hart <hartp@hpanis.an.hp.com>
41) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
42) Cushings-Pets Digest
by "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
43) Cushing's and pituitary surgery in humans...
by Leslie Lawson <lolawson@uts.cc.utexas.edu>
44) Make your own cooler mat!!
by Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
45) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by hilbro@juno.com (h hilbro)
46) Thanks to all!
by Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
47) RE: Diabetic cushbabies
by Jude Fine <jfine@novatel.ca>
48) UNSUBSCRIBE ME PLEASE!!!!!!
by wpersky@olivermcmillan.com
49) Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by Valerie Allen <VBAllen@concentric.net>
50) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by DLowder25@aol.com
51) Thanks!
by DLowder25@aol.com
52) Re: new list member
by Glimpact@aol.com
53) Re: new list member
by Susan West <swok34@swbell.net>
54) Re: Behavior Changes
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
55) Cushing's Links
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
56) Re: Cushings-Pets Digest
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
57) Re: new list member
by JCirino@aol.com
58) Re: Behavior Changes
by CBABTPC@aol.com
59) Re: Diabetic cushbabies
by DFRS2@aol.com
60) Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by "Scottee Meade" <scottee@huskynet.com>
61) another new member
by Paula Hart <hartp@hpanis.an.hp.com>
62) kennel shots safe?
by scott <scott@adams.net>
63) cataracts
by "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
64) Re: Cushings-Pets Digest
by Leslie Lawson <lolawson@uts.cc.utexas.edu>
65) Re: kennel shots safe?
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
66) Re: cataracts
by CBABTPC@aol.com
67) Re: Behavior Changes
by Jenny Kellstedt <jk@bradley.bradley.edu>
68) Re: new list member
by floyd@zianet.com
69) Re: Behavior Changes
by CBABTPC@aol.com
70) Re[2]: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by Jackie Siniard <siniardj@email.uah.edu>
71) Re: Behavior Changes
by Jenny Kellstedt <jk@bradley.bradley.edu>
72) Re: another new member
by JCirino@aol.com
73) Re: new list member
by JCirino@aol.com
74) Re: Re[2]: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by CBABTPC@aol.com
75) Re: Re[2]: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
76) Hi Everybody!!!!
by Miner <marcia@nortexinfo.net>
77) Diabetes list
by Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
78) personality changes
by sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
79) Re: Diabetes list
by CBABTPC@aol.com
80) 1st dose of Lysodren
by Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
81) Re: personality changes
by CBABTPC@aol.com
82) Re: 1st dose of Lysodren
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
83) Re: personality changes
by JCirino@aol.com
84) Re: 1st dose of Lysodren
by hilbro@juno.com (h hilbro)
85) Personnality Changes
by Robert Glover <rglove19@idt.net>
86) Magical Cures
by L Boyce <lboyce@warwick.net>
87) Re: cataracts
by Jeri <kurvenal@ameritech.net>
88) re: Springer
by Leslie Lawson <lolawson@uts.cc.utexas.edu>
89) Re: Cushing and Hypothyroidism
by LynneYoung@aol.com
90) Magical Cures
by L Boyce <lboyce@warwick.net>
91) Re: kennel shots safe?
by "Scottee Meade" <scottee@huskynet.com>
92) Re: Magical Cures
by Jeri <kurvenal@ameritech.net>
93) Re: personality changes
by Jenny Kellstedt <jk@bradley.bradley.edu>
94) 1st Lysodren dose
by DLowder25@aol.com
95) Blindness
by DLowder25@aol.com
96) Re: new list member
by Susan West <swok34@swbell.net>
97) Re: 1st dose of Lysodren
by "Capa97" <Capa97@ix.netcom.com>
98) Re: new list member
by JCirino@aol.com
99) cooling it
by Susan Kuchinskas <hautlynx@sirius.com>
100) I Didn't Forget!
by L Boyce <lboyce@warwick.net>
101) Diet
by "Scottee Meade" <scottee@huskynet.com>
102) Re: Diet
by Linda Wroth <lwroth@ix.netcom.com>
103) Re: Diet
by write2tom@juno.com (Thomas D Johnston)
104)
by Jackie Siniard <siniardj@email.uah.edu>
105) Re: Diet
by Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
106) Veterinarian and Anipryl Prescription
by Spot210@aol.com
107) Re: Veterinarian and Anipryl Prescription
by "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
108) Re: Veterinarian and Anipryl Prescription
by Danestuff@aol.com
109) Wrong Career
by L Boyce <lboyce@warwick.net>
110) Fwd: off topic - Humor - Gone to the Dogs
by DFRS2@aol.com
111) Re: Veterinarian and Anipryl Prescription
by DesignSue@aol.com
112) Re: Veterinarian and Anipryl Prescription
by DesignSue@aol.com
113) Re:
by Susan West <swok34@swbell.net>
114) Re: several topics covered
by "Capa97" <Capa97@ix.netcom.com>
115) Re: Veggies
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
116) Re: Lysodren tolerance
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
117) Re: Veterinarian and Anipryl Prescription
by Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
118) Re: several topics covered
by write2tom@juno.com (Thomas D Johnston)
119) introduction
by meri <meric@execpc.com>
120) Rosie - Need Quick Help 1:00 p.m. C.S.T.
by DFRS2@aol.com
121) Re: Rosie - Need Quick Help 1:00 p.m. C.S.T.
by JCirino@aol.com
122) Re: Rosie - Need Quick Help 1:00 p.m. C.S.T.
by Danestuff@aol.com
123) Re:
by write2tom@juno.com (Thomas D Johnston)
124) Re: Rosie - Need Quick Help 1:00 p.m. C.S.T.
by CBABTPC@aol.com
125) Pixie
by Tom Reighney <tomrei@bellsouth.net>

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Date: Tue, 30 Jun 1998 00:56:52 -0700
From: Linda Wroth <lwroth@ix.netcom.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: runny eyes
Message-ID: <35A07CE9.7D88@ix.netcom.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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My Cushing's dog's eyes run because she has small tear duct outlets; her
liver function showin in blood tests is fine :-).
Linda Wroth Richmond, CA lwroth@ix.netcom.com

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Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 08:56:07 -0500
From: "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: runny eyes
Message-ID: <9807060856.ZM23285@dvorak.amd.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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On Jul 5, 6:06pm, Cybervet5@aol.com wrote:
> Subject: Re: runny eyes
> In a message dated 98-07-05 15:34:31 EDT, Glimpact@aol.com writes:
>
> << the eyes are a reflection >>
>
>
> I was taught "the eyes are a reflection of the soul"....which means a
> thorough ophthalmic exam oftens detects many disease processes, which can
> include liver disease...
> M. Brownstein DVM
>-- End of excerpt from Cybervet5@aol.com

"the eyes are a window to the soul, and a dog has a soul with nothing to hide"

--
dillon pyron
dillon.pyron@amd.com
Hell hath no fury like root.

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Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 09:43:35 -0500
From: Jackie Siniard <siniardj@email.uah.edu>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re:runny eyes
Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19980706144335.00b96868@email.uah.edu>
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>Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 07:19:23 -0500
>From: SINIARD-RC@redstone.army.mil (SINIARD-RC)
>To: siniardj@email.uah.edu
>Subject: Re:runny eyes
>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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>
> THIS MESSAGE IS FROM RANDY (SUNNY'D DADDY) ONLY.
>
> Our Sunny has had runny eye's before, but since Cushing's and Lysodren
> treatment I have noticed they seem to be nonstop. She is a Manchester
> Chihuahua (18.5 lbs last Friday down from 18.7) She seems to be
> losing a little weight everytime we visit the Doctors. We'll take any
> loss. Anyway her eyes run especially outside in the sun. It is
> possible they are more susceptible to the outside environment since
> Lysodren was started.
>
> I am not sure if it is related to Lysodren or to Cushings. I know
> with Cushings the dog's immune system is broke down more, so they get
> sick easier and keep the illness longer once they get it. Our Sunny
> has had a sore throat through two 14 day courses of Clavamox, one 14
> day course of Baytril and now working on a liquid 14 day course of
> antibiotic (can't remember the name). Her water intake had jumped
> dramatically from 18-22 ounces a day to 32-39 ounces. But according
> to our new vet, Dr. Gorman, this is in line with a two year Cushings'
> diagnosed dog. He showed us a formula which showed how the increase
> in water consumption moved up the further a dog was into Cushings.
> Anyway, it set our mind at ease.
>
> The next good news was that after our two weeks of every other day
> dosing of 1/2 pill in a.m. and 1/2 pill in p.m. our Sunny did not have
> to have a Stim test done. Dr. Gorman checked her Urinalysis and found
> that it was improved over the last, so the Stim test was not called
> for yet. We are continuing the 1/2 pill dosing and he will recheck
> her in two weeks on July 17th. I am not sure how he tells from her
> Urine, but he does and Sunny was happy since she did not have to go
> through the torture of the needle. I guess he tends to be up on this
> disease more than our last vet because he has a Cushings baby too! If
> I were a vet I would know as much as I could about a disease my doggy
> had.
>
> I guess my main point to all this is that Sunny seems to be a little
> better except for her appetite! It hasn't changed, she still begs for
> food, but I glad she does. Her eyes run indoors, but more so outside.
> Cushings is just one of the most confusing diseases I know.
>
> REMEMBER THIS MESSAGE IS FROM RANDY (SUNNY'S DADDY) ONLY.
>
> If you should reply back to Jackie concerning this message address it
> to Randy (Sunny's Daddy) in the body of the message. As soon as I can
> find out for sure what my e-mail address is (Remember I have an
> outgoing and and incoming) I will add it to my messages.
>
> Randy (Sunny's Daddy) {[Jackie Sunny's Mummy], SUNNY, [Saphir
> Cat-Sister]}
>
>
>
>______________________________ Forward Header
__________________________________
>Subject: Re:runny eyes
>Author: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu at INTERNET
>Date: 7/3/98 5:34 PM
>
>
>Anyone have any experience with runny eyes in their
>Cushings dogs? Jesse, who is also diabetic, has had a lot of white
>matter in the corner of and over the surface of her eyes for the past few
>days. She may have allergies I don't know about. I missed the vet who
>closed for a three day holiday so I thought I would check with y'all.
>By the way where do you get Milk Thistle? How do you know what amount to
>give. Jesse is holding her own at 16.8 lbs.
>Also, I note that there is a lot of talk about weak hind legs. Jesse has
>never shown any sign of this, just a general wasting and weight loss at
>the beginning of this whole thing. Years ago she went unexplainably limp
>in her left hind leg and was given steroids at that time (?) and has
>never shown any sign of a limp or weakness since. Her front upper legs
>have lost the most muscle mass, but her back seem to have come back in
>the last month or so. She is still an agile jumper and smooth dancer.
>
>Tom, Jesse, & Uta (under the bed)
>
>_____________________________________________________________________
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>From: write2tom@juno.com (Thomas D Johnston)
>To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
>Subject: Re:runny eyes
>References: <B0002268640@kailua.huskynet.com>
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Love doesn't make the world go 'round: love is what makes the ride
worthwhile. - Franklin Jones

Jacqueline P. Siniard
Staff Assistant, Graduate Studies
The University of Alabama in Huntsville
Materials Science Building Room C206
Huntsville, Alabama 35899
ph: 205-890-6002 Fax:205-890-6349
e-mail: siniardj@email.uah.edu

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Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 11:28:24 -0400
From: "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
To: "cushings" <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: RE: Urine tests
Message-ID: <002b01bda8f2$b8124900$27e60bd0@chesters>
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I would be interested in what urine tests are used to check on the =
cushings meds. Gretle is on Anipryl 10Mg. once per day. She has =
diabetes which was well regulated and is now bouncing around. I =
mentioned several times that I am very concerned about a medication =
which regulates part of the hormone system being at one set amount =
without some means of testing. =20
I see the body trying to adjust to her insulin injection and food =
intake. I have seen the rebound swings when the blood sugar got too =
low. It seems beyond doubt that the animal's body would try to =
compensate for the change in steroid production and this would be at =
some varying level. If 10Mg will decrease symptoms that are patent, why =
doesn't it over suppress when the symptoms abate?
I noticed something that seems like compensation for cushings =
symptoms. Gretle is a red dachshund with black outer hair. When she =
was in the sun, the black hair would suck in the heat and the red hair =
seemed to hold the heat in. She would be hot to touch in the sun but =
cold in the same air out of the sun. Now, since she has Cushings and =
seems to overheat easily, she does not feel hot when in direct sunlight. =
Is this the reason the animal's hair changes color, etc., when they get =
Cushings?
chester

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<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I would be interested in what urine =
tests are=20
used to check on the cushings meds.  Gretle is on Anipryl 10Mg. =
once per=20
day.  She has diabetes which was well regulated and is now bouncing =

around.  I mentioned several times that I am very concerned about a =

medication which regulates part of the hormone system being at one set =
amount=20
without some means of testing.  </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>    I see the body =
trying to=20
adjust to her insulin injection and food intake.  I have seen the =
rebound=20
swings when the blood sugar got too low.  It seems beyond doubt =
that the=20
animal's body would try to compensate for the change in steroid =
production and=20
this would be at some varying level.  If 10Mg will decrease =
symptoms that=20
are patent, why doesn't it over suppress when the symptoms =
abate?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>    I noticed =
something that=20
seems like compensation for cushings symptoms.  Gretle is a red =
dachshund=20
with black outer hair.  When she was in the sun, the black hair =
would suck=20
in the heat and the red hair seemed to hold the heat in.  She would =
be hot=20
to touch in the sun but cold in the same air out of the sun.  Now, =
since=20
she has Cushings and seems to overheat easily, she does not feel hot =
when in=20
direct sunlight.  Is this the reason the animal's hair changes =
color, etc.,=20
when they get Cushings?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>chester</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 12:35:46 -0700
From: Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: new list member
Message-ID: <199807061934.MAA05783@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

My name is Elizabeth Rubin in Berkeley, CA as you can probably note from my
address.

I have 3 Brussels Giffons. Two are littermates born 1/31/91 (7 1/2 yrs)
and another born 5/92 that shares
some similar bloodlines.
These little guys are from a well known reputable breeder that claims all
of her lines have no health problems.
Breaker developed a cataract before the age of 2 yrs. I had already
finished his championship before discovering
the eye problem and had bred him. ( I stopped as soon as I found out) I
believe that this could be hereditary.

I thought that would be my worst problem...In Feb.98 due to the El Nino, we
had one entire month of rain and my
dogs gained weight. By March I noticed what little sausages the were and
began dieting them. By April, two had
slimmed down but Gabby looked bloated. I tkke them out to the dog park
with is flat easy terrain and noticed that Gabby had respiratory prblems
and no tolerance for ecercise. I thought that because they are out of
shape due to lack of exercise and that he was still alittle over weight
that this was the problem.

By May, I saw that he was not any slimmer, he was virtually licking the
kitchen floor looking for food and drank copius amounts of water. He had
slimmed down but still had a big belly like a wormy puppy. His breathing
bothered
me and since I see many patients with Congestive Heart Failure in my job as
a partime nurse I took him to the Vet and
said that I thought that he had CHF. Much to my surprise, he did! A fairly
young dog with no signs a health problems until a couple of months earlier
( and they were ambiguous). He had x-rays, etc. and I started him on
lasix, Enacard and Thyroid since his thyroid was low. He seemed better
although he was drinking 2.5 gal of water per day and this is a toy breed!
His appetite was (is) insatiable. The Vet said there was no diabetes and
that he
should be ok. His skin turned black, his hair fell out and other areas
became very thin, the liver is enlarged, his
cholesterol is triple what it should be , the SPGT liver enzymes were high
and the alkaline phosphatase levels
were very high. Still the Vet didn't seem concerned. After I read some
info on Cushings, he seemd to have most
of the symptoms. He has been tested and is postive. Discrimmination tests
are being done to determine the
source. This has taken another almost 3 weeks. I should have the definitive
results today and begin treatment.

well, that is my life story....but I do have questions:

1. Breaker and Gabby are litter mates and I am wondering if the Cataract
and Cushings are hereditary or if it is
considered familial. These are such young dogs. I have told the
owners of the offspring from this line of
breeding about the health concerns that I am having now so they can
be alerted to anything unual in their dogs.

2. I believe that I understand the side effects of the treatment that Gabby
will get from the mitotane tx. but what
can I expect long term?

a. Will the clinical symtoms ( big belly) go away with treatment?
b. Will his hair grow back into the bald spots? does he need
to be kept warmer now?
c. How do I exercise him with the 2 other dogs? will his
tolerance improve?
d. Everything that I have read says there is a 2 yr life
span...has anyone done better? ( I hope)
e. will a change in his diet improve his health?
f. Anipryl is supposed to help with alzheimer's symptoms but
the vet wants to use the other treatment
(mitotane) so will the dog become senile or a danger to
himself?
G. What types of other diseases might he get due to the
Cushings? What things should I watch for?

Well, I 've probably used up the max of 30K (ha) so I will quit now. I am
not usually so verbose but am so upset
by the DX and the 2 yr life span but no other info on how to live with my
dog in a way that is good for him , it
would be good to get the experiences of others for my own mental health.

Thanks for any sharing of experiences anyone can give me.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 14:58:41 -0500
From: sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Anipryl
Message-ID: <35A12C6A.705F@Tradepress.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

After 2 years on Lysodren, Puffin is now off that and on Anipryl. She
had been doing fine on the Lysodren, but Cushings symptoms returned
about 8 weeks ago -- panting, excess water drinking, etc. Our vet did a
STIM test and felt it was time to switch meds. She's been on Anipryl 10
days now. I have noticed the panting has decreased, and maybe the
drinking is a bit less, but her tummy seems much more bloated to me. So
far no vomiting or diarreha. Does it really take 1-2 months of Anipryl
before she gets better?

I know we're at the dreaded 2-yr. point, but I really need to hear from
those of you who've gone beyond that.

Thanks for listening.
Sandy & Puffin

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 14:56:47 -0400
From: Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <05256639.006CAD52.00@MTA-Austin2.tivoli.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

Hi Elizabeth and welcome to the list. I'm sure that you will get many
responses to your questions and I hope that you find it useful. My Kelso,
a scottie, will be 12 this month and was diagnosed with Cushings a year
ago. He is on the lysodren treatment and has tolerated it very well. With
treatment, you will find many of the symptoms subside. Kelso never really
lost a lot of hair, but I have noticed that it is now much thicker. The
appetite and drinking should also subside, especially the water intake.
Kelso still lets me know when it is dinner time, but he has always done
that. My initial vet also said the 2 year life span, but you will find
many on this list who have exceeded this. I just moved to Austin TX and
Kelso's new doctor said that with proper treatment, the 2 years is a
fallacy. I received a message from a scottie owner in California whose dog
lived over 7 years with Cushings. Kelso is ready for his first year
anniversary and showing no signs of slowing down. Be sure to watch for
signs of infection. Cushings will suppress the immune system and an
infection can quickly get out of control. We have noticed this with
mouth/gum infections. A simple infection quickly went into a bone
infection and Kelso had to have 3 teeth pulled. He was on antibotics for
months. I believe that urinary and bladder infections are also more
common. As others will tell you, be sure to have a great rapport with your
vet. If you don't feel comfortable now, find another one, especially one
experienced with Cushings. You may also find that your dog's heat
tolerance will be much lower. I turn down the AC at night just to keep him
comfortable.

Again, welcome to the list and give your pups a big hug!

Doreen

Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu> on 07/06/98 02:35:46 PM

Please respond to cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu

To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
cc: (bcc: Doreen A Osborne/Tivoli Systems)
Subject: new list member

Hi
My name is Elizabeth Rubin in Berkeley, CA as you can probably note from my
address.
I have 3 Brussels Giffons. Two are littermates born 1/31/91 (7 1/2 yrs)
and another born 5/92 that shares
some similar bloodlines.
These little guys are from a well known reputable breeder that claims all
of her lines have no health problems.
Breaker developed a cataract before the age of 2 yrs. I had already
finished his championship before discovering
the eye problem and had bred him. ( I stopped as soon as I found out) I
believe that this could be hereditary.
I thought that would be my worst problem...In Feb.98 due to the El Nino, we
had one entire month of rain and my
dogs gained weight. By March I noticed what little sausages the were and
began dieting them. By April, two had
slimmed down but Gabby looked bloated. I tkke them out to the dog park
with is flat easy terrain and noticed that Gabby had respiratory prblems
and no tolerance for ecercise. I thought that because they are out of
shape due to lack of exercise and that he was still alittle over weight
that this was the problem.
By May, I saw that he was not any slimmer, he was virtually licking the
kitchen floor looking for food and drank copius amounts of water. He had
slimmed down but still had a big belly like a wormy puppy. His breathing
bothered
me and since I see many patients with Congestive Heart Failure in my job as
a partime nurse I took him to the Vet and
said that I thought that he had CHF. Much to my surprise, he did! A fairly
young dog with no signs a health problems until a couple of months earlier
( and they were ambiguous). He had x-rays, etc. and I started him on
lasix, Enacard and Thyroid since his thyroid was low. He seemed better
although he was drinking 2.5 gal of water per day and this is a toy breed!
His appetite was (is) insatiable. The Vet said there was no diabetes and
that he
should be ok. His skin turned black, his hair fell out and other areas
became very thin, the liver is enlarged, his
cholesterol is triple what it should be , the SPGT liver enzymes were high
and the alkaline phosphatase levels
were very high. Still the Vet didn't seem concerned. After I read some
info on Cushings, he seemd to have most
of the symptoms. He has been tested and is postive. Discrimmination tests
are being done to determine the
source. This has taken another almost 3 weeks. I should have the definitive
results today and begin treatment.
well, that is my life story....but I do have questions:
1. Breaker and Gabby are litter mates and I am wondering if the Cataract
and Cushings are hereditary or if it is
considered familial. These are such young dogs. I have told the
owners of the offspring from this line of
breeding about the health concerns that I am having now so they can
be alerted to anything unual in their dogs.
2. I believe that I understand the side effects of the treatment that Gabby
will get from the mitotane tx. but what
can I expect long term?
a. Will the clinical symtoms ( big belly) go away with
treatment?
b. Will his hair grow back into the bald spots? does he need
to be kept warmer now?
c. How do I exercise him with the 2 other dogs? will his
tolerance improve?
d. Everything that I have read says there is a 2 yr life
span...has anyone done better? ( I hope)
e. will a change in his diet improve his health?
f. Anipryl is supposed to help with alzheimer's symptoms but
the vet wants to use the other treatment
(mitotane) so will the dog become senile or a danger to
himself?
G. What types of other diseases might he get due to the
Cushings? What things should I watch for?
Well, I 've probably used up the max of 30K (ha) so I will quit now. I am
not usually so verbose but am so upset
by the DX and the 2 yr life span but no other info on how to live with my
dog in a way that is good for him , it
would be good to get the experiences of others for my own mental health.
Thanks for any sharing of experiences anyone can give me.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 16:04:59 EDT
From: JCirino@aol.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <e45d9234.35a12dec@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Hello Sandy,
I just subscribed to this list and my dog was just recently diagnosed with
Cushings. He is currently on Anipryl (1 month). My vet originally told me it
would take up to 3 months to see any improvement. How true this may be I don't
know, but to date I do not see much improvement so I may have to continue
waiting it out to see.
I have never tried the other med you mentioned as he was only diagnosed in May
of 98.
Joan

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 16:10:27 EDT
From: JCirino@aol.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <98168d8.35a12f34@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Hi everyone,
I am new to this list. I have a shetland sheepdog, approx. 12 yrs old,
diagnosed with Cushings in May who has been on Anipryl for the last month. I
have seen no improvement as yet but have been told it could take 3 months to
see anything. Does anyone know which, Anipryl or the other med for Cushings
is better or has better tolerance than the other. I am new to all of this and
I guess, very impatient, wanting to see some kind of improvement for my
friend. I guess I want to know if I'm doing the best I can by him. Any
suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Joan

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 15:13:33 -0500
From: "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <9807061513.ZM8105@dvorak.amd.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Well, you've taken the time to get yourself well informed, you care enough
about your pups to love them, and you're asking your vet all the right
questions.

Ivan recovered, visually, almost completely within a few short months. In
fact, my wife went out of town for two weeks right after he started on
Lysodren, and her first reaction was "he has hair"! Most of his signs and
symptoms abated, although he was always a hungry puppy.

We also had his littermate, Molly, and Carol's parents had another littermate,
Peter. Sadly, Molly died in February, 1995 due to acute autoimmune hemolytic
anemia (due, we think, to vaccination reaction). Peter died two weeks before
Ivan, but never showed any signs of Cushings.

Ivan did quite well, and was alert and very bright up to the end. Letting him
go was all the more painful because of this.

--
dillon pyron
dillon.pyron@amd.com
Hell hath no fury like root.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 15:23:38 -0500
From: "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <9807061523.ZM8375@dvorak.amd.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I've forgotten how old Puffin is, but our vet said he wouldn't have given two
cents for Ivan's making it the three plus years he did. At 14 1/2, he did
pretty good. I think there's something that makes our little furkids tougher,
maybe it's our love, maybe it's their's.

--
dillon pyron
dillon.pyron@amd.com
Hell hath no fury like root.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 15:38:01 -0500
From: sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <35A135A0.14A4@Tradepress.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Puffin will be 12 in Nov. She's a wimp on the outside, but a tough
little cookie on the inside. She's ruled the roost since 8 weeks old. I
personally think it's our love and good care that keeps 'em going. I
will cook special meals for her and get a part time job for medicine if
I have to. She's my baby!

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 15:44:59 -0500
From: "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <9807061544.ZM9106@dvorak.amd.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

On Jul 6, 3:38pm, Sandy Mannix wrote:
> Subject: Re: Anipryl
> Puffin will be 12 in Nov. She's a wimp on the outside, but a tough
> little cookie on the inside. She's ruled the roost since 8 weeks old. I
> personally think it's our love and good care that keeps 'em going. I
> will cook special meals for her and get a part time job for medicine if
> I have to. She's my baby!
>-- End of excerpt from Sandy Mannix

Sounds like you could be stuck with her for sometime to come!

--
dillon pyron
dillon.pyron@amd.com
Hell hath no fury like root.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 15:56:05 -0500
From: sandy.mannix@tradepress.com (Sandy Mannix)
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <35A139DC.2C8C@Tradepress.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Dillon
Thanks for the great words of encouragement! I'm feeling a bit anxious
right now. We had such good results with the Lysodren in the beginning
that I want the same to happen on the Anipryl.

Sandy & Puffin

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 14:01:24 -0700
From: Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
To: "'cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu'"
<cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: RE: new list member
Message-ID: <199807062058.NAA05567@eve.atm.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Hi all!

I'm also a new list member. My 7-1/2 year old "son" Herbie
(beagle/retriever mix) was diagnosed with pituitary Cushings just two
weeks ago. We noticed Herbie drinking much more water than usual, so we
started doing searches on the Web for information. I ran across several
articles on Cushings and realized he had some of the other symptoms as
well (i.e., low tolerance for exercise, skin irritations, increased
appetite, increased panting, etc.). I took Herbie to the vet and
expressed my concern about Cushings. The vet said Herbie didn't look
like a typical Cushinoid dog and, in fact, after performing a physical
exam, said Herbie seemed extremely healthy. However, he said the
symptoms I told him about indicate he could have Cushings. After
several rounds of tests, he determined Herbie does have Cushings. He
consulted with an Internist to verify his diagnosis. By the way, he
also verified Herbie does not have Diabetes or any other complications.

The vet will be putting Herbie on Anipryl to begin with. He mentioned
Mitotane as an alternative (costs less), but said both he and the
Internist implore us to use Anipryl if we can afford it. He said
Mitotane is an extremely harsh drug, and there is a higher probability
of death if the improper dosage is given. He said with Mitotane, Herbie
will most likely be very ill initially when he begins treatment. With
Anipryl, he will not be ill; plus, there are no side effects with
Anipryl. He did warn us that if Herbie doesn't respond to Anipryl, he
would have to try Mitotane. What are other people's experiences with
these two drugs?

Regarding the 2-year lifespan... I had read the same thing, and was
quite concerned. However, when I asked the vet about Herbie's
prognosis, he said 7 to 10 years if he responds favorably to treatment.
I had to ask him to repeat himself because I couldn't believe what I
heard!! I mentioned the 2-year lifespan I had read about, and he said
that was not accurate. I felt better after hearing this, but I'm still
curious to hear from others out there about what they've heard or been
through personally.

One other note of interest. The Internist told the vet to do a urine
culture for a bladder infection. The vet didn't think it was necessary
after initial urine test results, but the Internist explained that
there've been a lot of recent studies that show a high percentage of
Cushinoid dogs have undiagnosed bladder and/or kidney infections. I
don't remember the details, but the reason the infections are not
diagnosed has something to do with the fact that Cushinoid dogs urinate
so frequently. My vet said he couldn't argue with the results of the
studies, so he agreed to do a urine culture. We'll bring in a urine
sample when we pick up Herbie's first dosage of Anipryl.

I have one question maybe someone can answer. Does anyone know of a
veterinary hospital anywhere in the country that performs surgery to
remove pituitary tumors? If so, which hospital, and do you know their
success rate? I read an article in Life Magazine about Angell Memorial
Animal Hospital in Boston, and wondered if maybe someone there has
performed such a surgery. They sound like a very advanced, impressive
hospital. I realize this is dangerous, risky surgery, but I want to
explore all options. I would do anything to help Herbie, and I would be
willing to take him anywhere in the country for help.

Thank you all for your support! Please add us to your prayers!!

Shari, Tom, and Herbie Peterson

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 14:07:20 -0700
From: Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <199807062106.OAA31292@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html>
<font size=3D3>At 03:44 PM 7/6/98 -0500, you wrote:<br>
>On Jul 6,=A0 3:38pm, Sandy Mannix wrote:<br>
>> Subject: Re: Anipryl<br>
>> Puffin will be 12 in Nov. She's a wimp on the outside, but a
tough<br>
>> little cookie on the inside. She's ruled the roost since 8 weeks
old. I<br>
>> personally think it's our love and good care that keeps 'em
going. I<br>
>> will cook special meals for her and get a part time job for
medicine if<br>
>> I have to. She's my baby!<br>
>>-- End of excerpt from Sandy Mannix<br>
><br>
>Sounds like you could be stuck with her for sometime to come!<br>
>>-- <br>
>dillon pyron<br>
>dillon.pyron@amd.com<br>
<br>
<br>
I hope you are "stuck" with Puffin for  quite a long
time!<br>
Elizabeth</font>
<BR>
</html>

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 16:16:35 -0400
From: Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: RE: new list member
Message-ID: <05256639.0073F187.00@MTA-Austin2.tivoli.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

Hi Shari and Herbie and welcome to the list. We have lots of new people
this week!! :( My scottie, Kelso, is on lysodren. I also was very
concerned about lysodren. About a month before Kelso was diagnosed,
another scottie that I know had a very adverse reaction to the lysodren
loading and died. I was in a panic because my vet was not familiar with
anipril and wanted me to try the lysodren first. I took all the
precautions including persuading my boss to let me work at home during the
loading phase just to watch Kelso for any reactions. I basically
interrogated my vet as to what to watch for ( I didn't know that this list
existed at the time) and spoke with him almost every day. Kelso started
reaching conversion on day 5. On day 6, he refused food all together and I
knew that we were there. Again, my vet was there every step of the way.
Besides a few episodes of vomiting, Kelso has tolerated the lysodren very
well. My new vet here in Austin, now states that good control is the key
to this disease and the number of years that dogs survive.

We wish you well with your baby and we are here to help. I wish that I had
known about this list a year ago. Many thanks to Leslie for starting this
and in heartfelt memory of Missy. I know that she is happy and waiting for
Leslie and Scot at the Rainbow Bridge.

Doreen, Kelso and Blair

ShariPe@Attachmate.com on 07/06/98 04:01:24 PM

Please respond to cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu

To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
cc: (bcc: Doreen A Osborne/Tivoli Systems)
Subject: RE: new list member

Hi all!

Thank you all for your support! Please add us to your prayers!!

Shari, Tom, and Herbie Peterson

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 14:37:12 -0700
From: Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
To: "'cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu'"
<cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: RE: new list member
Message-ID: <199807062134.OAA07795@eve.atm.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"

Thanks for the welcome and words of encouragement, Doreen!

I am so glad I discovered this list!

Shari

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com [SMTP:Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 06, 1998 1:17 PM
> To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
> Subject: RE: new list member
>
>
> Hi Shari and Herbie and welcome to the list. We have lots of new
> people
> this week!! :( My scottie, Kelso, is on lysodren. I also was very
> concerned about lysodren. About a month before Kelso was diagnosed,
> another scottie that I know had a very adverse reaction to the
> lysodren
> loading and died. I was in a panic because my vet was not familiar
> with
> anipril and wanted me to try the lysodren first. I took all the
> precautions including persuading my boss to let me work at home during
> the
> loading phase just to watch Kelso for any reactions. I basically
> interrogated my vet as to what to watch for ( I didn't know that this
> list
> existed at the time) and spoke with him almost every day. Kelso
> started
> reaching conversion on day 5. On day 6, he refused food all together
> and I
> knew that we were there. Again, my vet was there every step of the
> way.
> Besides a few episodes of vomiting, Kelso has tolerated the lysodren
> very
> well. My new vet here in Austin, now states that good control is the
> key
> to this disease and the number of years that dogs survive.
>
> We wish you well with your baby and we are here to help. I wish that
> I had
> known about this list a year ago. Many thanks to Leslie for starting
> this
> and in heartfelt memory of Missy. I know that she is happy and
> waiting for
> Leslie and Scot at the Rainbow Bridge.
>
> Doreen, Kelso and Blair
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ShariPe@Attachmate.com on 07/06/98 04:01:24 PM
>
> Please respond to cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
>
> To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
> cc: (bcc: Doreen A Osborne/Tivoli Systems)
> Subject: RE: new list member
>
>
>
>
> Hi all!
>
> I'm also a new list member. My 7-1/2 year old "son" Herbie
> (beagle/retriever mix) was diagnosed with pituitary Cushings just two
> weeks ago. We noticed Herbie drinking much more water than usual, so
> we
> started doing searches on the Web for information. I ran across
> several
> articles on Cushings and realized he had some of the other symptoms as
> well (i.e., low tolerance for exercise, skin irritations, increased
> appetite, increased panting, etc.). I took Herbie to the vet and
> expressed my concern about Cushings. The vet said Herbie didn't look
> like a typical Cushinoid dog and, in fact, after performing a physical
> exam, said Herbie seemed extremely healthy. However, he said the
> symptoms I told him about indicate he could have Cushings. After
> several rounds of tests, he determined Herbie does have Cushings. He
> consulted with an Internist to verify his diagnosis. By the way, he
> also verified Herbie does not have Diabetes or any other
> complications.
>
> The vet will be putting Herbie on Anipryl to begin with. He mentioned
> Mitotane as an alternative (costs less), but said both he and the
> Internist implore us to use Anipryl if we can afford it. He said
> Mitotane is an extremely harsh drug, and there is a higher probability
> of death if the improper dosage is given. He said with Mitotane,
> Herbie
> will most likely be very ill initially when he begins treatment. With
> Anipryl, he will not be ill; plus, there are no side effects with
> Anipryl. He did warn us that if Herbie doesn't respond to Anipryl, he
> would have to try Mitotane. What are other people's experiences with
> these two drugs?
>
> Regarding the 2-year lifespan... I had read the same thing, and was
> quite concerned. However, when I asked the vet about Herbie's
> prognosis, he said 7 to 10 years if he responds favorably to
> treatment.
> I had to ask him to repeat himself because I couldn't believe what I
> heard!! I mentioned the 2-year lifespan I had read about, and he said
> that was not accurate. I felt better after hearing this, but I'm
> still
> curious to hear from others out there about what they've heard or been
> through personally.
>
> One other note of interest. The Internist told the vet to do a urine
> culture for a bladder infection. The vet didn't think it was
> necessary
> after initial urine test results, but the Internist explained that
> there've been a lot of recent studies that show a high percentage of
> Cushinoid dogs have undiagnosed bladder and/or kidney infections. I
> don't remember the details, but the reason the infections are not
> diagnosed has something to do with the fact that Cushinoid dogs
> urinate
> so frequently. My vet said he couldn't argue with the results of the
> studies, so he agreed to do a urine culture. We'll bring in a urine
> sample when we pick up Herbie's first dosage of Anipryl.
>
> I have one question maybe someone can answer. Does anyone know of a
> veterinary hospital anywhere in the country that performs surgery to
> remove pituitary tumors? If so, which hospital, and do you know their
> success rate? I read an article in Life Magazine about Angell Memorial
> Animal Hospital in Boston, and wondered if maybe someone there has
> performed such a surgery. They sound like a very advanced, impressive
> hospital. I realize this is dangerous, risky surgery, but I want to
> explore all options. I would do anything to help Herbie, and I would
> be
> willing to take him anywhere in the country for help.
>
> Thank you all for your support! Please add us to your prayers!!
>
> Shari, Tom, and Herbie Peterson
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 17:13:33 -0500
From: "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <9807061713.ZM12427@dvorak.amd.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

>
I have one question maybe someone can answer. Does anyone know of a
veterinary hospital anywhere in the country that performs surgery to
remove pituitary tumors? If so, which hospital, and do you know their
success rate? I read an article in Life Magazine about Angell Memorial
Animal Hospital in Boston, and wondered if maybe someone there has
performed such a surgery. They sound like a very advanced, impressive
hospital. I realize this is dangerous, risky surgery, but I want to
explore all options. I would do anything to help Herbie, and I would be
willing to take him anywhere in the country for help.
<
I believe that UC-Davis has done some in the past. It is not as easy a
procedure for dogs as it is for humans (we have a "built in" access path that
dogs don't have).

--
dillon pyron
dillon.pyron@amd.com
Hell hath no fury like root.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 19:12:09 -0300
From: L Boyce <lboyce@warwick.net>
To: CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Schonus Update
Message-ID: <35A14BB9.74D2CF89@warwick.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Everyone...

Just a short note to let you all know that Schonus is now going thru
another loading phase. Think this is #4!! Everything sure is outta
whack here....water intake sky rocketed...distended belly...and I lost a
finger last week giving him a treat (only kidding)! ....colitis has
returned and now we've got a huge lick spot on top of his front paw!

There's just one thing I can't figure out...we were giving him 4,500 mgs
a week and every time he was given Lysodren, his water intake went way
up. BUT on the day that he was to get Lysodren, it dropped to normal.
It was like the Lysodren was causing him to drink more...the more
Lysodren...the more water.

I also would like to take this time to say "Thank You" to all of you who
share your good news! It gives me the strength to keep up with this
roller coaster ride! It really helps!

Linda & Schonus

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Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 17:07:52 -0700
From: Susan Kuchinskas <hautlynx@sirius.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: just a quickie
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980706170752.00d454e0@pop.sirius.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi, Linda, I'm sorry I haven't had time to write butr I do think about you
and Schonus every day, and tell my friends about you two. I saw your post
on the list.... gawd I want him to get better. morre drinking and peeing
here, but more hair too. more soon Susan
>

Susan Kuchinskas

http://www.sirius.com/~hautlynx/

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Date: Mon, 6 Jul 98 21:30:52 -0400
From: <loiskos@ix.netcom.com>
To: "Cushing's Disease" <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
Message-ID: <199807070125.UAA01960@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

>Side effects. The only noticeable thing is her sight! She seems
>to be going blind. This only seems to happen when she comes inside from
>the bright outside. Yes, I try and keep her going straight but I have 3
>other dogs and everybody is poking coming thru the door. Has this
>happened to anybody else. After all, Springer is 13 years old, but
>this just started 2 days after the medication.
YEP. Duffy too lost a good deal of sight very quickly. White spots
visible in eyes. Hearing too is limited.
Just in last few days his sense of orientation has deteroiated. Walks
into corners and can't find way out. Walks into areas of a room he's
never been in before, then can't figure out where he is.
Poor guy just "zonks" -- so very sasd to watch, not knowing what I can
do. Try to get his attention, take his head in my hands and talk to him.
After leading him out of corner...
Sine he's showing some deterioratin, I'm tkaing him off the amitriptyline
(anti-depressant). Woudl rathe have him a bit grouchy than spaced out.
Will reprot if progress.

LOIS

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Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 21:31:14 -0400
From: Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list members
Message-ID: <35A17A62.1A630CCA@mediaone.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Wow, so many new members today! Welcome to everyone. Sorry you have to
be here, but I'm glad you found us! I'm no expert at Cushing's disease
since my poodle, Boomer, was just diagnosed in March, but he is doing
well now so I thought I would share what I know with ya'll and try to
answer some of your questions to the best of my ability.

Elizabeth Rubin wrote:
1. Breaker and Gabby are litter mates and I am wondering if the Cataract
and Cushings are hereditary or if it is considered familial.
>> I don't believe that Cushing's is hereditary.

2. I believe that I understand the side effects of the treatment that
Gabby
will get from the mitotane tx. but what can I expect long term?
>> Never heard of mitotane. Is this the same as Lysodren??

a. Will the clinical symtoms ( big belly) go away with treatment?
>> The belly should go away or at least get smaller

b. Will his hair grow back into the bald spots?
does he need to be kept warmer now?
>> Hair should grow back, for some quickly, some slowly, some not at all
>> Boomer doesn't seem to be colder, in fact he seeks out cool spots.

c. How do I exercise him with the 2 other dogs? will his tolerance
improve?
>> I would exercise him only as much as he can take,
>> not sure if his tolerance will improve

d. Everything that I have read says there is a 2 yr life span...has
anyone done better? ( I hope)
>> Many dogs live longer than 2 years. It all depends on so many factors:
>> the age of dog at diagnosis, how well they respond to treatment,
>> other health factors, and I believe the love and care their owners
>> give them. I have to wonder if this "2 yr life span" was stated many
>> years ago when there wasn;t much known about the disease and its prognosis
>> was rather bleak then. But times have changed...so who knows???

e. will a change in his diet improve his health?
>> A good diet is very important for dogs with cushing's.

f. Anipryl is supposed to help with alzheimer's symptoms but the vet
wants to use the other treatment (mitotane) so will the dog become
senile or a danger to
himself?
>> Again if you are referring to Lysodren I have not heard of it making
>> a dog senile or dangerous.

G. What types of other diseases might he get due to the Cushings? What
things should I watch for?
>> Cushy dogs are more susceptible to other infections since their
>> immune system is suppressed.

Keep in mind that every dog is different and it is important that you
work very closely with your vet. It's up to you to "interpret" how your
dog is feeling based on his behavior. And most of all, give your cushy
poo lots of love and attention. It can make you and him/her feel much
better :)

-- Liza and Boomer

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Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 21:31:08 EDT
From: DLowder25@aol.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <1ee3088e.35a17a5e@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 98-07-06 15:39:11 EDT, you write:

<< Will his hair grow back into the bald spots? does he need
to be kept warmer now? >>

Elizabeth:
Welcome to the group. They've been a big help to me and Mollie Bear.
Mollie Bear was diagnosed a little over a year ago. She's been on Lysodren
ever since. If you look on the Cushings Gallery, you will see a very furry
dog. She was bald last year so, if nothing else, the Lysodren has worked
miracles to get her gorgeous fur back.
A couple months ago she was diagnosed with diabetes too. That's another
thing to watch for. I thought she was having a major relapse from the
Cushings because the symptoms are so similar. It's been difficult to control
but she's doing much better. Both diseases are under control (pretty much)
and she's doing well.
So keep the faith....hard to do but this group helps a lot with support and
info.

Debbie & Mollie Bear

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 21:33:32 -0400
From: Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Anipryl
Message-ID: <35A17AEC.4FD67364@mediaone.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Does anyone know if this typically happens (the reoccurence of symptoms)
after being on Lysodren for a couple of years?

-- Liza and Boomer

Sandy Mannix wrote:
>
> After 2 years on Lysodren, Puffin is now off that and on Anipryl. She
> had been doing fine on the Lysodren, but Cushings symptoms returned
> about 8 weeks ago -- panting, excess water drinking, etc. Our vet did a
> STIM test and felt it was time to switch meds. She's been on Anipryl 10
> days now. I have noticed the panting has decreased, and maybe the
> drinking is a bit less, but her tummy seems much more bloated to me. So
> far no vomiting or diarreha. Does it really take 1-2 months of Anipryl
> before she gets better?
>
> I know we're at the dreaded 2-yr. point, but I really need to hear from
> those of you who've gone beyond that.
>
> Thanks for listening.
> Sandy & Puffin

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 21:40:28 -0400
From: Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <35A17C8C.F56247B3@mediaone.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Joan,
I don't know that either medicine is better than the other. Both
have their pluses and minuses. If your vet suggested one over the other
and you trust your vet, then I would follow his advice. My vet had his
reasons for choosing Lysodren for Boomer, so we are using it. So far,
it seems to be working wsell, although I'm not sure we are at the proper
dosage yet.

-- Liza and Boomer

JCirino@aol.com wrote:
Does anyone know which, Anipryl or the other med for Cushings is better
or has better tolerance than the other.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 21:41:19 EDT
From: DLowder25@aol.com
To: CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <7b56ff7a.35a17cc0@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Just went to the vet yesterday for Toby (my other dog who has a bad limp)
and my vet informed me that Mollie's insulin is to be discontinued in January.
We just got her under "control" at 173 and now we have to switch insulin.
Anyone else heard this? She's on Lente and my vet said we'll have to use
Humulin from now on and it doesn't work as well in dogs. They said they
weren't selling enough to continue making it (Mollie uses almost a bottle a
week--isn't that helping the company???)
Any experience out there with Humulin? Thanks! Debbie & Mollie Bear

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 98 21:47:48 -0400
From: <loiskos@ix.netcom.com>
To: "Cushing's Disease" <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
Message-ID: <199807070142.UAA03429@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

>I would like your opinions on the following:
>1. Could this aggressiveness be related to the Cushings? Is she just
>getting senile? (Bonsai might be calling her names, but I never notice
>any provocation on her part)

Duffy's doc said "definitely YES" when he became quite an untouchable
grouch with Cushings. Vet was not surprised.

LOIS

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 21:51:21 -0400
From: Cindy Venable <cindyv@ntr.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <199807070154.VAA24445@rome.ntr.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

My Pepper is on PZI because she developed antibodies to humulin; she was doing
well on it - and really still is, but now she's started on anipryl for the
cushings. So far so good.

DLowder25@aol.com wrote:

> Just went to the vet yesterday for Toby (my other dog who has a bad limp)
> and my vet informed me that Mollie's insulin is to be discontinued in January.
> We just got her under "control" at 173 and now we have to switch insulin.
> Anyone else heard this? She's on Lente and my vet said we'll have to use
> Humulin from now on and it doesn't work as well in dogs. They said they
> weren't selling enough to continue making it (Mollie uses almost a bottle a
> week--isn't that helping the company???)
> Any experience out there with Humulin? Thanks! Debbie & Mollie Bear

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 21:59:09 -0400
From: Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <35A180ED.C9CEB445@mediaone.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Shari,
Welcome to the list and I wish you and Herbie good luck in your
treatment.
While your vet is correct that Mitotane (Lysodren?) is a harsh drug and
if given in too large amounts it can be life threatening, I don't
believe that a dog will necessarily be very ill during the initial
treatment. The course of treatment with Lysodren consists of an initial
"loading" phase, where the dog is given the med daily unitl the symptoms
(increased thirst, hunger, urination) subside. Once that occurs you
stop the medicine until an ACTH Stim test is done to determine where the
dog's cortisone level is. Based on that you determine a maintenance
dosage and go from there.
During Boomer's loading phase, he showed no change until the ninth
day. On the tenth day he would not eat and I could tell that he did not
feel good. I stopped the medication then and we started the maintenance
phase. Within a few days he was felling better and his appetite
gradually returned. With Lysodren it is very important that you learn
to "read" your dog. If he is having an "off" day, then a little
Prednisone can be given to make him feel better. I gave Boomer
Prednisone every other day for the first month of the maintenance phase,
but have not had to give it since. This is just my experience with
Lysodren, others may have had different results.
As for Anipryl, it is not without side effects. I believe that
diarrhea is one of them, but I'm not that familiar with its use.
As for the 2 year lifespan...I don't believe there have been any
scientific studies to supprt this claim. I believe it was someone's
educated guess. Again, this is the information I have read.
Good luck to you and Herbie! Keep us posted to his progress!

-- Liza and Boomer

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 22:00:54 -0400
From: Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Schonus Update
Message-ID: <35A18156.774091C5@mediaone.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Linda,
Just know that we are here "for the ride" with you! Let's hope that
4 is the lucky number!

-- Liza and Boomer

L Boyce wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone...
>
> Just a short note to let you all know that Schonus is now going thru
> another loading phase. Think this is #4!!

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 21:11:41 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jenny Kellstedt <jk@bradley.bradley.edu>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.95.980706204837.26936B-100000@bradley.bradley.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

When I asked this following Sweetie's diagnosis of pituitary tumors, I was
told by the doctor at the University of Illinois Small Animal Clinic that
surgery was only being tried in the Netherlands, with very limited
success. The one human being I have encountered with similar Cushings was
also not a candidate for brain surgery. If you should find out anything
different, please contact me! Please!

Sweetie recently developed an infection between the toes of her right foot
but I discovered her gnawing and got her on antibiotics and have been
putting ointment on the foot, covering it with a sock for 15 minutes so
the ointment will soak in thoroughly without interruption. She is now
doing fine. I had been putting the tea tree oil on it to no avail.

Anipryl truly does seem to take 3-4 mos. to totally assimilate, though
Sweetie's panting and drinking of water eased in the first few weeks.
In her case, I suspect the combination of anipryl, thyroid meds,
glucosamine chondroitin, milk thistle and varied vitamins has given her
back vitality and playfulness.

I am eagerly awaiting delivery of much-heralded Canine Cooler Bed. The
"inventor" is a very sweet guy who majored in zoology. So pleasing to give
one's money to a small business entrepreneur who really cares 'bout dogs!
Best wishes to all & the wonderful dogs.

Jenny & Sweetie
jk@bradley.bradley.edu

On Mon, 6 Jul 1998, Dillon Pyron wrote:

> >
> I have one question maybe someone can answer. Does anyone know of a
> veterinary hospital anywhere in the country that performs surgery to
> remove pituitary tumors? If so, which hospital, and do you know their
> success rate? I read an article in Life Magazine about Angell Memorial
> Animal Hospital in Boston, and wondered if maybe someone there has
> performed such a surgery. They sound like a very advanced, impressive
> hospital. I realize this is dangerous, risky surgery, but I want to
> explore all options. I would do anything to help Herbie, and I would be
> willing to take him anywhere in the country for help.
> <
> I believe that UC-Davis has done some in the past. It is not as easy a
> procedure for dogs as it is for humans (we have a "built in" access path that
> dogs don't have).
>
>
> --
> dillon pyron
> dillon.pyron@amd.com
> Hell hath no fury like root.
>

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 22:07:46 -0400
From: "Capa97" <Capa97@ix.netcom.com>
To: <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <199807070230.VAA17263@dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi, Sam was on Anipryl for 3 months with no improvement, but no side
effects.Then we went to :
She has had to do two loading doses with Lysodren & Prednisone( for no side
effects, first time 10 days, then wait 7 days for Prednisone to leave
before tests. No real change. Then seven days with no Pred . Tested great!
Now on maintance (2 pill a week). She has Diabetes also & is starting
cataracts.
Has anyone else had trouble with DRY EYES ( no tears working) with Cush-
Diabete - Cataracts
Pat & Sam
> From: JCirino@aol.com
> To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
> Subject: Re: new list member
> Date: Monday, July 06, 1998 4:10 PM
>
> Hi everyone,
> I am new to this list. I have a shetland sheepdog, approx. 12 yrs old,
> diagnosed with Cushings in May who has been on Anipryl for the last
month. I
> have seen no improvement as yet but have been told it could take 3 months
to
> see anything. Does anyone know which, Anipryl or the other med for
Cushings
> is better or has better tolerance than the other. I am new to all of this
and
> I guess, very impatient, wanting to see some kind of improvement for my
> friend. I guess I want to know if I'm doing the best I can by him. Any
> suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
> Joan

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 22:37:54 EDT
From: hilbro@juno.com (h hilbro)
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <19980706.213002.9983.0.hilbro@juno.com>

On Mon, 6 Jul 1998 21:41:19 EDT DLowder25@aol.com writes:
> Just went to the vet yesterday for Toby (my other dog who has a bad
>limp) and my vet informed me that Mollie's insulin is to be discontinued
in
>January. We just got her under "control" at 173 and now we have to
switch
>insulin. Anyone else heard this? She's on Lente and my vet said we'll
have
>to use Humulin from now on and it doesn't work as well in dogs. They
said
>they weren't selling enough to continue making it (Mollie uses almost a
>bottle a week--isn't that helping the company???)
> Any experience out there with Humulin?

Eli Lilly has discontinued manufacture of Iletin I Lente and NPH
beef/pork insulin, although current stocks will continue to be available
through most of 1999 according to their marketing people. Though pure
pork will still be made for a while, it will probably follow suit and be
discontinued because, as you say, these species insulins are not
profitable for the companies that make them. Beef/pork insulin is
usually about 90% beef which differs from dog insulin by three amino
acids, and only 10% pork which is identical to dog insulin in amino acid
structure but doesn't have good duration. Human insulin differs from dog
and pork insulin by only one position and is, therefore, theoretically an
appropriate choice for dog insulin therapy.

Recent studies by Richard Nelson, DVM, UCal-Davis, et al. indicate that,
in fact, serum anti-insulin antibodies are more prevalent in diabetic
dogs treated with beef/pork versus recombinant human insulin and that
these antibodies may adversely affect glycemic control in some dogs.
Nelson and colleagues are using Humulin (available in all durations,
generally recommended is Lente or NPH b.i.d.) as first-line treatment in
dogs, even before the beef/pork becomes unavailable, because they now
feel that sustained glycemic control is more likely with this protocol.
There is reason to believe that the beef/pork discontinuation is sort of
a "tempest in a teapot" and not a real cause for worry based on these
extensive research results indicating such good results with human
insulins for dogs. The studies are quite recent and are just now being
presented in veterinary Continuing Education seminars, so may not have
been widely disseminated yet. But the data is available to veterinarians
through professional sources.

We have recently switched one of our diabetic dogs from beef/pork to
Humulin insulin and, after an initial re-regulation, she is doing well.
The Humulin is said to do a better job with subduing post-prandial BG
spikes and I would concur with that claim based on my observations.
Therefore. a flatter curve is attainable and, consequently, tighter
glycemic control is likely possible.

It is a pity that drug companies must rely solely on profit for
manufacturing justification (although the FDA will sometimes step in on a
compassionate use basis), but in this case it appears that there is
little reason for worry.

H. Brown
Prennydew Labradors
Thanks! Debbie & Mollie
>Bear
>

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 23:35:09 -0000
From: "Scottee Meade" <scottee@huskynet.com>
To: <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <B0002279096@kailua.huskynet.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Elizabeth,

Sorry for all your bad luck!

Check with your vet. I'm told (not from a vet) that Enacard is a brand
name for a generic drug named Vasotec--a prescription of Vasotec filled at
your local pharmacy (ideally Walmart or Price Club/Costco) is less
expensive than Enacard. Verify that and then ask for a prescription.

I had a dog diagnosed with congestive heart failure. He lived more than 2
years longer than that diagnosis, probably due to my feeding him a homemade
diet most of that time.

----------------
Scottee Meade <Scottee@huskynet.com> 'Tee Party Bostons
Canine Behavior Consultant Burke, VA
Member, Association of Pet Dog Trainers and Old Dominion Kennel Club
----------------

----------
From: Elizabeth Rubin <ehr@uclink4.berkeley.edu>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: new list member
Date: Monday, July 06, 1998 7:35 PM

My name is Elizabeth Rubin in Berkeley, CA as you can probably note from my
address.

well, that is my life story....but I do have questions:

2. I believe that I understand the side effects of the treatment that Gabby
will get from the mitotane tx. but what
can I expect long term?

a. Will the clinical symtoms ( big belly) go away with
treatment?
b. Will his hair grow back into the bald spots? does he need
to be kept warmer now?
c. How do I exercise him with the 2 other dogs? will his
tolerance improve?
d. Everything that I have read says there is a 2 yr life
span...has anyone done better? ( I hope)
e. will a change in his diet improve his health?
f. Anipryl is supposed to help with alzheimer's symptoms but
the vet wants to use the other treatment
(mitotane) so will the dog become senile or a danger to
himself?
G. What types of other diseases might he get due to the
Cushings? What things should I watch for?

Thanks for any sharing of experiences anyone can give me.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 00:23:14 -0400
From: write2tom@juno.com (Thomas D Johnston)
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: several topics covered
Message-ID: <19980707.002319.13950.4.Write2Tom@juno.com>

Debbie: My Jesse (7 yr. mini-schnauzer, Cushings/diabetic) has been on
Humulin for the past 5 or 6 months. She has proven to be a brittle
diabetic and still not completely controlled though she is doing better.
Do not expect overnight control with this disease as it is mostly just
trial and error, then under control, then starting all over again. At
least that has been our experience.

Shari: Jesse went through two brief loadings with Lysodren with no
prednesone and no ill effects. We are now on hold for two months before
testing again. Some days she is a puppy again and some days she is
cranky. Mostly she is brave, loving and accepting of her situation.

Pat: Jesse too has cataracts forming and the vet says she probably has
very blurred vision and is perhaps seeing mostly light and shadows. He
offered to set her up with a specialist in Louisville if I wanted, but we
must be realistic about the amount of money we have to spend at this
point. (these are very expensive conditions to treat and we have another
dog with a portosystemic shunt who must be medicated and fed as well.) I
took her to the vet today because of a mucus discharge from her eyes over
the week-end. She has always been prone to conjunctivitis, but never has
her tear ducts stopped up before because of it. We are doing twice daily
cleaning with saline solution and three times medication with Neo-Predef.
Back in five days for another tear test. Sometimes an eye infection is
just an eye infection.

Everybody stick in there and love your pets.

Tom, Jesse and Uta (learning to be a guide dog)

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 09:42:21 EDT
From: CBABTPC@aol.com
To: loiskos@IX.NETCOM.COM, owner-cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu,
cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
Message-ID: <2846b5fd.35a225be@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Targa isn't grouchy at all, but she is definitely more remote and less
affectionate. I have to really press her for "kisses" now. She doesn't
spontaneously interact at all. I don't know whether this is related more to
the Cushing's or to her sudden blindness, but it was a real change in
personality.

Anne and Targa

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 08:44:15 -0500
From: "Dillon Pyron" <dillon.pyron@amd.com>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <9807070844.ZM12609@dvorak.amd.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Regarding surgery, I was contacted a few years back by a guy who was a diver
and wanted to know how long after "skull surgery" he could dive. I asked him
what kind, he told me they had cut out a small portion of this sinus cavity,
removed the tumour and reattached the wall. Doctor told him 6 to 9 months, I'm
an instructor, not a doctor, who am I to argue with that. His name is Scooter,
I think Leslie has a link, although it may be out of date.

Anyways, the problem is that, for dogs, the pituitary is more deeply imbedded
in the brain, and located more directly behind the eyes.

I'm not a vet. I'm not stubborn enough :-)

--
dillon pyron
dillon.pyron@amd.com
Hell hath no fury like root.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 09:48:11 EDT
From: CBABTPC@aol.com
To: cindyv@ntr.net, owner-cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu,
cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <348b82b2.35a2271c@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 7/6/98 8:59:31 PM, cindyv@ntr.net wrote:

> Any experience out there with Humulin? Thanks! Debbie & Mollie Bear

Missed your earlier post, Debbie.

Targa has been on Humulin since her diagnosis and is doing fine on it. It took
awhile to hit the right dose, as with any insulin, but since regulation she's
stayed completely stable. We've increased it slightly twice, as she regained
the weight she lost from the diabetes initially, and so far we have had no
hypo incidents. (6 months) She has been on Anipryl since April, and there
have been no problems using the two together that we could see.

Anne and Targa

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 98 10:08:27 EDT
From: Paula Hart <hartp@hpanis.an.hp.com>
To: CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: new lister with questions!
Message-ID: <9807071408.AA11742@hpanis.an.hp.com>

Hi,

I just subscribed to this list and am trying to gather as much info as
possible regarding cushings and my dog. Any feedback would be greatly
appreciated.

I have a 9 year old German Shepherd who, over the past couple of months,
has been drinking/urinating more that normal. I was concerned about
diabetes & made an appt at the vet for him. His initial blood work &
urinalysis came back normal, so the scheduled him for a low dose dex
test last Thursday. Of course the vet is now on vacation & the results
came in this morning. The vet on call summarized the results abnormal, but
really wants me to wait til our regular vet comes back to discuss the
details.

The test showed a baseline cortisol level of 3.7, followed by readings
of 1.0 at 4 hours and 1.1 at 8 hours. It's the 8 hour test that she said
should be 1.0 and that the 1.1 is considered abnormal. In my own little
mind I see the 1.0 and 1.1 as still supressed & wonder just how diagnostic
a reading of 1.1 at 8 hours is.

Can anyone shed any light here? I am worried sick about this dog and am
trying to get as much info as possible while I wait for the return of our
vet.

Thanks, in advance, for any information.

Paula

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 10:17:35 -0400
From: "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
To: <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <002c01bda9b1$fe0e56a0$27e60bd0@chesters>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I started out with humulin N with Gretle and she seems to be doing well on
it. She has some swings in bg but do not think it is the insulin. Did you
subscribe to the diabetic list as they have done a lot of research on the
insulins?
chester
-----Original Message-----
From: DLowder25@aol.com <DLowder25@aol.com>
To: CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
<CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Date: Monday, July 06, 1998 9:43 PM
Subject: Diabetic cushbabies

> Just went to the vet yesterday for Toby (my other dog who has a bad limp)
>and my vet informed me that Mollie's insulin is to be discontinued in
January.
>We just got her under "control" at 173 and now we have to switch insulin.
> Anyone else heard this? She's on Lente and my vet said we'll have to use
>Humulin from now on and it doesn't work as well in dogs. They said they
>weren't selling enough to continue making it (Mollie uses almost a bottle a
>week--isn't that helping the company???)
> Any experience out there with Humulin? Thanks! Debbie & Mollie Bear
>

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 10:37:47 -0400
From: "chester b. smith" <chesterb@penn.com>
To: "cushings" <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Cushings-Pets Digest
Message-ID: <005201bda9b4$d02169a0$27e60bd0@chesters>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004F_01BDA993.48140480"

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_004F_01BDA993.48140480
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

How do you change over to the digest form of the list?
chester

------=_NextPart_000_004F_01BDA993.48140480
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.6"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>How do you change over to the digest =
form of the=20
list?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>chester</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_004F_01BDA993.48140480--

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 10:10:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: Leslie Lawson <lolawson@uts.cc.utexas.edu>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Cushing's and pituitary surgery in humans...
Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.3.96.980707100234.17453C-100000@curly.cc.utexas.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Dillon wrote:
Regarding surgery, I was contacted a few years back by a guy who was a
diver and wanted to know how long after "skull surgery" he could dive. I
asked him what kind, he told me they had cut out a small portion of this
sinus cavity, removed the tumour and reattached the wall. Doctor told him
6 to 9 months, I'm an instructor, not a doctor, who am I to argue with
that. His name is Scooter, I think Leslie has a link, although it may be
out of date.
******************

I was so bummed when Scott (aka Scotter) pulled his Cushing's web page
down, and I've been hunting for it since. His page detailed his entire
experience with Cushing's and included incredible before and after photos.

I did another search for him today and I'm believe I've found him. I sent
a note asking him to temporarily join us so that we could learn a little
more about Cushing's from someone who's been through it and who can speak
English (as opposed to just barking....). I'll keep you posted on his
response.

Thanks for the reminder about Scotter, Dillon. What a great
coincidence--another Austinite and a diver to boot. His was the very
first Cushing's web page I found when I began my search.

-Leslie

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 11:14:24 -0400
From: Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Make your own cooler mat!!
Message-ID: <0525663A.00581410.00@MTA-Austin2.tivoli.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

I know that there has been info on buying cooler mats, but you can make
your own. This has been posted on the scottie list. If anyone is
interested in making me one for Kelso, he would greatly appreciate it since
his mam has trouble sewing on buttons!!

The only question that I have on these---if you put these down on carpet,
won't the carpet get wet??? Again, I have never seen one of these, but
they sound great. If someone has bought a commercial one, please fill us
in on how they work.

Happy sewing!!

Doreen

Cooler Mats

Go to your plant nursery and get a package of Polymer Granules. It will
probably have a brand name but the stuff is the same, AKA x-linked
polyacrylamide. It has a fantastic absorption rate; one pound of the
granules will hold 50 gallons of pure water, less if the water is high in
minerals or salts.

Lay out the size mat you think you'll want, top and bottom pieces. Sew
around the three sides, then sew parallel tubes in fabric about 1 1/2
inches wide, leaving end open.

Put about 1 teaspoon of the granules per 12 inches of length of the tube, 2
teaspoons for a tube 24 inches in length, then sew across the fourth side.

Place the mat in water. About 30 minutes will give you 50% absorption, 60
to 90 minutes should give you 100% absorption. If you find it's too full
or not full enough, let it dry for several days and just add or subtract
granules.

The commercial ones have a fabric envelope that works as a cover and close
with Velcro, but they work fine without it.

Care instructions:

WARNING: when not in use, hang in well ventilated area. This will prevent
mildew.

Washing instructions: hand wash in mild soap. Rinse thoroughly and hang to
dry in a well-ventilated area. Do not machine wash or dry.

If desired, place cooler in zip lock bag and place in refrigerator. This
will keep the cooler hydrated for months. If longer storage is desired,
dry the cooler.

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 12:28:14 EDT
From: hilbro@juno.com (h hilbro)
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <19980707.112009.9983.3.hilbro@juno.com>

H. Brown
Prennydew Labradors
Thanks! Debbie & Mollie
>Bear
>
--------- End forwarded message ----------

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 10:26:56 -0700
From: Shari Peterson <ShariPe@Attachmate.com>
To: "'Cushings listserv'" <CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: Thanks to all!
Message-ID: <199807071725.KAA26238@eve.atm.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Rather than respond individually to each person who has addressed my
questions and warmly welcomed Herbie and I to the list, I thought it
best to send out one big THANK YOU!! The postings have been very
helpful, and I look forward to learning more.

Shari and Herbie

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 12:11:50 -0600
From: Jude Fine <jfine@novatel.ca>
To: "'cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu'"
<cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>
Subject: RE: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <71EF2C533A9BD11187FF006097DF400851343A@ntsrv004.corp.novatel.ca>

My diabetic poodle, Emily, has been on Humulin N for almost two years now with
no problems. Her fellow diabetic (also cushinoid), Molly, is also on Humulin N
succesfully.
Jude

Jude Fine
Senior Canine Rescue Society
jfine@novatel.ca; olddoglady@writeme.com
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Prairie/9703/
"Hug an Old Dog Today"

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 12:02:07 -0700
From: wpersky@olivermcmillan.com
To: <cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu>, <listproc@yangtze.cren.net>
Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE ME PLEASE!!!!!!
Message-ID: <FB98EA2F9B2AD111BF3A00A0C9495D47174C53@SERVER>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

CUSHINGS-PET UNSUBSCRIBE wpersky@olivermcmillan.com

PLEASE HELP ME. I HAVE SENT THREE REQUESTS TO listproc@listproc.listproc.net
SINCE 6/22/98 AND THREE REQUESTS TO THIS EMAIL ADDRESS TO GET UNSUBSCRIBED.
MY EX-WIFE IS REMAINING A MEMBER AND FORWARDING TO ME ANY INFORMATION
PERTINENT TO OUR SCOTTISH TERRIER WITH CUSHINGS. PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE
UNSUBSCRIBE ME. THANK YOU.

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
[mailto:owner-cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu]On Behalf Of
Doreen_A_Osborne@tivoli.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 1998 10:48 AM
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: RE: new list member

Doreen, Kelso and Blair

ShariPe@Attachmate.com on 07/06/98 04:01:24 PM

Please respond to cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu

To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
cc: (bcc: Doreen A Osborne/Tivoli Systems)
Subject: RE: new list member

Hi all!

Thank you all for your support! Please add us to your prayers!!

Shari, Tom, and Herbie Peterson

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 17:51:45 -0400
From: Valerie Allen <VBAllen@concentric.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: CUSHINGS-PETS digest 41
Message-ID: <35A29870.3C11@concentric.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Lois,

I can't remember if Duffy is on Lysodren or Anipryl, but I've read that
Anipryl is used to treat Canine Cognitive Dysfunction (see
http://www.moorshead.com/pets/cd.htm), which sounds a lot like what
you're describing. On the other hand, Cleo showed some of those
symptoms (including hearing loss) when she had an ear infection! What
does your vet say?

Val and crew...
Cleo, Honey and Bandit

loiskos@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
> >Side effects. The only noticeable thing is her sight! She seems
> >to be going blind. This only seems to happen when she comes inside from
> >the bright outside. Yes, I try and keep her going straight but I have 3
> >other dogs and everybody is poking coming thru the door. Has this
> >happened to anybody else. After all, Springer is 13 years old, but
> >this just started 2 days after the medication.
> YEP. Duffy too lost a good deal of sight very quickly. White spots
> visible in eyes. Hearing too is limited.
> Just in last few days his sense of orientation has deteroiated. Walks
> into corners and can't find way out. Walks into areas of a room he's
> never been in before, then can't figure out where he is.
> Poor guy just "zonks" -- so very sasd to watch, not knowing what I can
> do. Try to get his attention, take his head in my hands and talk to him.
> After leading him out of corner...
> Sine he's showing some deterioratin, I'm tkaing him off the amitriptyline
> (anti-depressant). Woudl rathe have him a bit grouchy than spaced out.
> Will reprot if progress.
>
> LOIS

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 20:01:44 EDT
From: DLowder25@aol.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Diabetic cushbabies
Message-ID: <5e9b896d.35a2b6ea@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 98-07-07 10:19:06 EDT, you write:

<< subscribe to the diabetic list >>
I've misplaced the address. Could you give it to me again? I need help
with the diabetic end for sure. She's still not totally controlled but close.
It's becoming more frustrating than the Cushings! Thanks, Debbie & Mollie
Bear

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 20:09:14 EDT
From: DLowder25@aol.com
To: CUSHINGS-PETS@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Thanks!
Message-ID: <1ee776b1.35a2b8ab@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Thanks to all for responding to my diabetic Humulin/Lente question. I feel
a lot better. Maybe we'll get better control with the Humulin. The Lente
isn't really doing the trick. She's on 40 units twice a day and is still
running close to 200. We ran 350-500 for two months with no real change until
a couple weeks ago. She's 65 lbs by the way. (Yes, 40 units twice a day---a
little insulin resistant perhaps!?)
A couple people have noted personality changes in their pups due to the
drugs/disease whatever. Mollie, too, has gone thru a change but it's to a
move lovable dog. She's much more affectionate than she ever was. One big
plus for the disease from our standpoint (the only one actually).
Thanks again! Debbie & Mollie Bear (and brother Toby)

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 20:31:54 EDT
From: Glimpact@aol.com
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <d0178c4f.35a2bdfb@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

One of the leading Cushing's veterinary doctors is at the Universoty of
California at Davis. This is his e-mail address:

ecfeldman@ucdavis.edu

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 19:48:24 -0500
From: Susan West <swok34@swbell.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: new list member
Message-ID: <35A2C1D8.26CA4A09@swbell.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

JCirino@aol.com wrote:

> Hi everyone,
> I am new to this list. I have a shetland sheepdog, approx. 12 yrs old,
> diagnosed with Cushings in May who has been on Anipryl for the last month. I
> have seen no improvement as yet but have been told it could take 3 months to
> see anything. Does anyone know which, Anipryl or the other med for Cushings
> is better or has better tolerance than the other. I am new to all of this and
> I guess, very impatient, wanting to see some kind of improvement for my
> friend. I guess I want to know if I'm doing the best I can by him. Any
> suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
> Joan

I don't know which one is better, though I do believe from what I 've read and
been told, I would much rather stay with the Anipryl than Lydrosen. Pinetta has
been on Anipryl now about 6/7 weeks and I've noticed very little change; but she
had few symptoms, too. I have noticed her activity level increase dramatically
over the past week and am guessing the Anipryl is just perhaps beginning to
work. It is so HOT here in Oklahoma.....so I'm not sure what part's Cushing's
and what part's summer heat. Though she does stay indoors.....the 104 degree
walks are killers and I try to limit those.

susan

----__ListProc__NextPart____CUSHINGS-PETS__digest_42

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 21:19:09 -0400
From: Liza Klosterman <gatorpoo@mediaone.net>
To: cushings-pets@mcfeeley.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Behavior Changes
Message-ID: <35A2C90D.F00E7D53@mediaone.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

We've noticed that Boomer has become more affectionate in the past few
months, wanting to sit or lay in my lap and eat up the attention!

-- Liza and Boomer(I love my mommy's lap!)

CBABTPC@aol.com wrote:
>
> Targa isn't grouchy at all, but she is definitely more remote and less
> affectionate. I have to really press her for "kisses" now. She doesn't
> spontaneously interact at all. I don't know whether this is related more to
> the Cushing's or to her sudden blindness, but it was a real change in
> personality.
>
> Anne and Targa

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