Alt.Magick.Chaos Rants

Alt.Magick.Chaos Rants

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From: Data
Subject: Rants

05. Rants

05.01. Chaos Magick?

By: Hanafax

"The Lords of Chaos are
the enemies of Logic,
the jugglers of Truth,
the molders of Beauty"
-- Hanafax from _The Knight of the Swords_ by Michael Moorcock

By: Peter Carroll

"...if you want a one-line definition with which most Chaoists would probably not disagree, then I offer the following. Chaoists usually accept the meta-belief that belief is a tool for achieving effects; it is not an end in itself." -- Peter Carroll January, 1992

By: anon

In Chaos Magic, beliefs are not seen as ends in themselves, but as tools for creating desired effects. To fully realize this is to face a terrible freedom in which Nothing is True and Everything is Permitted, which is to say that everything is possible, there are no certainties, and the consequences can be ghastly. Laughter seems to be the only defence against the realisation that one does not even have a real self.

So welcome to the Kali Yuga of the Pandaemonaeon wherein nothing is true and everything is permissable. For in these post-absolutist days it is better to build upon the shifting sands than the rock which will confound you on the day it shatters. Philosophers have become no more than the keepers of useful sarcasms, for the secret is out that there is no secret of the universe. All is Chaos and evolution is going nowhere in particular. It is pure chance which rules the universe and thus, and only thus, is life good. We are born accidentally into a random world where only seeming causes lead to apparent effects, and very little is predetermined, thank Chaos.

Reject then the obscenities of contrived uniformity, order and purpose. Turn and face the tidal wave of Chaos from which philosophers have been fleeing in terror for millennia. Leap in and come out surfing its crest, sporting amidst the limitless weirdness and mystery in all things, for those who reject false certainties. Thank Chaos we shall never exhaust it. Create, destroy, enjoy, IO CHAOS!

From: duo@teleport.com (Gratuitous Pseudonym)

>Chaos magick (I have not a CLUE what this is)

That's a good start. Chaos magicians are an unruly lot, literally. They are basically magickal anarchists and admirers of no rules other than their own, arrived at by their own personal experiences. Many of them (but by no means all) have been heavily influenced by the Discordian Society and the writings of Malaclypse the Younger, worshippers of Discordia, or Eris, Goddess of Strife and Confusion. Very few generalizations hold for this kind of magick.

From: tom@realcase.com

Let witches hold their spells for fear of cryptic retribution.

Let museum piece ceremonials whisper of black magick and it's traps.

Let celibate mystics decry the baseness of the left hand path.

Of this, the chaote cares nothing. I go beyond thelema : my will is not only the whole of the the law, it is the basis for the entire universe. I am god, and some systems of morality hold that things are 'right' because god says so. I do what I desire, hard, and without regret, to whoever/whatever/whenever presents itself as target.

Coyote320

http://www.eskimo.com/~carcosa/topy.html

From: pali151@netcom.com (Tzimon Yliaster)

It begins with knowing how near and how far Whatever is. Then you concentrate on the placement of objects. Take neither nourishment, nor stimulant nor any drug. Use pain, when it comes, as a sharp wedge into the lower half.

Dance. Climb a mountain. Strip off your clothes (read civilization) and break something cherished that owns you as you own it.

Avoid recruiters, and shoo away those who want to "teach you magick". To paraphrase Austin Spare, all any teacher can do is show you your own magnificence.

Examine your obsessions. What are they, really? Fuel. Burn them up and move on. Don't let anything restrict you, least of all "groups" (the shortest path to nowhere). Every group implies hierarchy, whatever their press kits may say, and any structure is a lessening of the degree of freedom. Chaos is the greatest degree of freedom there can be, as it encompasses all potential and possibility.

Turn your will against your fears and your insecurities. Bury yourself. Hang upside-down and sing "Hallelujah" in public. People will think you mad, but what's one more madman, and isn't madness often little more than the folly of genius?

You *are* involved! Everything is involved, and it's really a question of what the nature of your involvement will be. Welcome; I hope we haven't kept you waiting too long :=}

Try everything. Be ye manic!!! We are all our own set of variables, and for each of us there are at least slightly different ways by which we can shortcut cause-and-effect. The only secrets are the ones that have to do with the ways that work for *you*, even if others say you're wrong. All that matters is effectiveness, and the only way to find these keys is to *do*. It takes time, and it takes effort, and maybe even a little bit of your own substance; think of it as an investment, if nothing more. It will, without question, pay off.

But you have to start *now*... because a part of the set of variables is time, and its a very limiting factor.

Lean way back, hold your breath, and count backwards from 418.

It's begun :=}

From: "Joseph Max.555"

Chaos Magick is currently the cutting edge of modern Ceremonial Magick. It largely grew out of the work of Austin Osman Spare, though it has been fractalized into many forms over the last 10 or so years.

Chaos Magick emphasizes a personal, experimental approach to magickal practice, de-emphasizes "traditional" approaches (ie. GD, OTO, et al) especially as regards "secret knowledge", male/female dichotomies and order hierarchy; what can be learned from Masters or Gurus is far less important or effective than what a dedicated researcher can discover for hirself. As such, shamanism is incorporated more directly than such historical approaches as Kaballa, though most Chaotes are quite adept at examining traditional systems, incorporating what works and discarding that which holds no personal appeal.

Chaos Magicians look at Magick as being a _living_ art rather than an _antique_ one. They regard the various belief structures of magick as being the _means_ rather than the _end_, and the most adept can alter their belief-state as easily as they change clothes. Chaos Magick recognizes no particular system of theology as having any more "reality" than any other, and most Chaotes (like Jung) approach dieties as being no more than archtypical constructs of the subconscious mind. Therefore they are far less concerned with having any (in their eyes) arbitrary moral system pounded into their skulls before getting to actually put magickal techniques into practical use than "Old Aeon" systems like the GD's or Abra-Melin.

Chaos Magick propounds no particular dogma or moral system, beyond it's most common identifier: "Nothing is True, and Everything is Permitted."

I have yet to meet, however, any adept Chaos Magician who doesn't have a strong sense of personal ethics and subscribe to it feverently.

From: locklin@phyast.pitt.edu (Lupo the Butcher)

"Chaos Theory" is generally concerned with making more complex physical predictions, sometimes based on a "chaos/order" measurement. "Chaos Magick" may or may not be concerned with utelizing paradigms of "chaos theory" to exert change in accordance with ones telos (in my case it would certainly be the former)...

"Chaos Magick" may also be the latest attempt to appeal to the testosterone junkie set of the magickal community via their lust of destruction, much as other LHP groups (Satanists & sinister Pagans) do in other ways.

From: Benjamin Rowe

I have received several complaints about my published rituals recently. Some complain that they are too elaborate, others that they are too simple, and some question whether they really qualify as magickal rituals in the traditional sense. There is some justice in all these, and they should be addressed with respect to the work presented here.

The complaints of over-elaborateness stem from the fact that it is impossible to perform any significant part of the works in a single session. This is perfectly correct, and is done deliberately. My experience has been that the rewards given to the magician by the "angels" of the Enochian system are very precisely gauged to the amount of care and effort the magician puts into the work. Works that are planned, rehearsed, and carried out over a period of weeks or months are much more likely to produce significant initiations than any number of single-session efforts. The present work was designed to be performed in stages, with the expectation that each stage will be performed until the powers invoked achieve a self-sustaining presence in the magicianAs temple before he passes on to the next stage. It can be expected that the rewards will be commensurate with the effort involved.

Complaints of excessive simplicity derive from lack of the pompous verbiage typically found in formal rituals, and the dearth of advice concerning symbols, implements, and materiel that would help to fire the imagination of the magician. There is a decidedly bare-bones feel to the descriptions. This is perhaps an expression of my own character as a magician; I find that complex pomp and ceremony put me off rather than enhancing the work. I have complete faith that every magicianAs imagination and intuition will provide him with enhancements appropriate to his or her own character and style, and so see no need to provide more than the minimum schema necessary to accomplish the work successfully.

[from _COMSELHA: A spiritual excercise for Enochian magicians]

05.02. Chaos Order?

From z@cluster.net

Any appearance of organization is result of sorcerous attacks by the Lords of Order.

From: johnson@sleipnir.pb.wes.mot.com (Mark Johnson)

Beware of equating things based on the occurence of the same label.

We are talking about three things here:

1. Chaos science: the characterization of nonlinear phenomena to facilitate a limited mathematical predictability. 2. Chaos: disorder. The absence or diminished presence of order where a higher degree of order is expected. 3. Chaos: the elemental force of creation and destruction, as opposed to order, the sustaining and suppressing force.

3 is the original definition, from the greek. 2 is a common misinterpretation, and 1 is a name chosen by mathematicians on the grounds that it sounds cool.

From: pali151@netcom.com (Tzimon Yliaster) Subject: Re: Stalking 101

Tyagi Mordred Nagasiva (Tyagi@cup.portal.com) wrote: : The way that I define 'chaos', it does *not* include organization. : There is no perceivable order inherent to anything that is 'chaotic'. : Therefore, 'chaotic organization' is, with this definition, : meaningless, and oxy-moron. : Tzi, I'd like to know what 'chaos' means to you that it might contain : any hint of organization at any time. Thanks. : Tyagi

Order is a subset of Chaos, temporarily existent at times, and drawing its existence from our perception. A group of individuals may work together in a coherent way to accomplish a chaotick act, and when the act is finished, move on. As long as they have done so of their own whim and will, then they haven't acted in any way that is counter to chaos. This only comes when permanence is forced upon them.

Chaos, at a human level, means doing what one chooses, rather than following a set of rules. If this includes a desire to form some sort of group to achieve some aim, then so be it. To *restrict* oneself from doing so because of someone else's rules, opinions, or perceptions would be far more orderly than to do it.

From: ReaperD@aol.com (The Grin Reaper)

>If Carrol emphasizes the use of 'chaos' as a source of power, >instead of the more positive 'kia', >that means he deliberatly chooses the abyss >... should I say it ... going into de-evolution ...

This is only true if you accept two of things as true. 1] Disorder=Distruction 2] Chaos=Disorder

As a Discordian, I feel that these assumptions are more correct. 1] Disorder= BOTH creative and destructive 2] Order= BOTH creative and destructive 3] Chaos= Both Order and Disorder in a formless state.

For more information consult your pinial gland.

http://www.willamette.edu/webdev/principia/>

From: afgm@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Fra Semper Non Sequitur)

An added elaboration is to draw a distinction between Chaos and disorder. To me, Chaos is a level above the artificial distinctions of either order/disorder. Hence, to say Chaos (in the higher sense) contains order is meaningless, but equally to say Chaos contains disorder is meaningless (both being eqully illusory).

However, in a less lofty sense, I say again that Chaos contains order and disorder, organization ( eg the human body / colony of ants), disorganization ( muddy water), and plenty of it. She aint your average everyday type Goddess.

The upshot :

1) With Chaos as above,the fount of all, terms such as (dis)organization are quite meaningless. Take neither term.

2) With Chaos as below,the 'natural' world, terms such as (dis)organization are uesfull only in pairs. Take both of them.

3) With whatever Chaos, to dismiss organization and have only disorder, is a bizarre worshipping of a single side of a polarity, eg Christianity. Take both or neither.

From: cipher@pentagon.io.com (Rev. Dr. J. B. Bell)

Some people have been debating whether all Chaos magick must of necessity be anarchic.

I think the answer is, clearly not. I personally think of Order as a subset of Chaos. Complete *dis*order is merely entropy, and just as boring and awful as total anal-retentive Order. What makes the whole of chaos interesting is the contrast between the schmuzzle and the foamy, intricate bubbles of Order. They form spontaneously, and break down just as unpredictably.

The point, I think, of Chaoism, or at least *my* Chaoism, is not to eschew order, but simply to understand its transitory nautre and use that. I may be a Chaos magician, but I rather dig *perversely* orderly things like Kabbalah. They're so incredibly ordered, they're chaotic!

Another point of Chaoism (how could it be *the* point anyway?): Have Fun. If you need some order to have fun, you should summon it--then, when you're done, dispose of it, don't worship it because of what it did for you.

From: raudlee@xyplex.com

Chaos can be beautiful and good. Order can be dangerous and evil. As any carpenter will tell you, some tools are dangerous. Dangerous tools are safest when properly sharpened, and used by experts. You get to be an expert by practicing your sharpening skills, not by hacking away.......

From: amanda@intercon.com (Amanda Walker)

I'd say that written rules are at their most useful when, in fact, they *subvert* order. Look at the U.S. Constitution, the Magna Carta, Civil Rights legislation, and so on. People are still arguing over the Second Amendment...

Unwritten rules are used far more often to maintain order, since they are implicit parts of a world-view, rather than explicit concepts which can be critically examined. Examples are discrimination based on race, sex, or academic qualifications, religious bigotry, and so on.

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